No one wakes up with the goal of discouraging their child, however too often we provoke our children without even thinking about it. So why does this happen so often? Chris and Mike talk about some of the lessons they’ve learned on just how easy it is to be a jerk to our children vs being gentle, patient, loving, and kind as we disciple them.
Colossians 3:21 – Fathers, do not provoke your children, lest they become discouraged.
Proverbs 16:9 – The heart of man plans his way, but the Lord establishes his steps.
Proverbs 19:11 – Good sense makes one slow to anger, and it is his glory to overlook an offense.
Leave us a voicemail online and send us your experience or thoughts to info@notquitethereshow.com
Visit nqtshow.com and visit here to see all available platforms this podcast is now available on!
No father wakes up planning to discourage his child — and yet “fathers, do not provoke your children, lest they become discouraged” (Colossians 3:21) is in the Bible because we all do it. In this episode, Mike and Chris get honest about what provoking actually looks like in a real house — the harsh quick fix, the blow-up when the kids interrupt a stressful day — and what the opposite is: patient, gentle discipleship, starting with the power of a dad who apologizes. Below: the key takeaways, the scriptures discussed, and the full episode transcript.
What “Provoke” Actually Means — The Chris Howard Translation
Provoke, embitter, exasperate — the translations vary, but the guys land on a definition every dad understands: don’t be a jerk to your kids. It’s not the healthy discomfort of conviction or correction; it’s communicating so harshly that you shut a child down and stunt their progress — the opposite of discipleship. Colossians 3 addresses the whole household, but verse 21 calls out fathers specifically, because the words and actions of the man designed to lead the home land with extra force — for damage or for good. That weight cuts both ways: the same role that can crush a child can powerfully disciple one.
The Most Powerful Parenting Moment: Apologizing to Your Kids
Mike shares that some of the most powerful moments in his home have come from walking back in and saying, “I’m sorry — I lost my cool, that wasn’t loving. Will you forgive me?” Neither he nor Joelle grew up seeing that modeled regularly, and the effect on his kids is unmistakable — wide-eyed, fully listening, watching their dad own it. Chris has seen the same with his daughter: those are the moments a child sees a real person with a real need for Christ, and the conversation naturally turns to forgiveness and mercy. An apology models repentance better than a lecture ever could — and refusing to apologize out of pride just teaches them pride.
Warning Signs You’re Drifting Toward Provoking
Chris names two tells, both visible in the kids before dad says a word: children who hide, get deceitful, or fear admitting mistakes have often already learned to expect a blow-up; and children who fire sass right back may feel they have to challenge dad just to survive the exchange. Mike is honest about his own trigger — it’s rarely a conscious choice to provoke, it’s selfishness: a long day, stress, the kids interrupting, and the flesh reaching for the quick fix (yell, send them to their rooms) instead of the slow work of discipling. The provoked dad provokes; the calm dad — “supernaturally calm,” Holy Spirit calm — teaches, and days later the kids come apologizing unprompted, because they take their cues from him.
Open Hands: Let the Lord Establish Your Steps
The banner verse of the episode is Proverbs 16:9 — “The heart of man plans his way, but the Lord establishes his steps.” Mike’s daily practice: lay out the to-do list, the worries, the plans, and pray with open hands — “Today is really about Your calendar, not mine. Direct my steps.” Chris adds his own version: “Show me the path forward” — not the whole five-year plan, just the next step. Two encouragements inside that verse: you have to actually get up and take a step for God to establish it, and He usually establishes steps, not decades — which takes the crushing pressure off “be a perfect dad forever” and replaces it with “walk faithfully today.”
To Not Provoke, Don’t Be Provoked
Chris flips the verse: the dad who doesn’t want to provoke his children must deal with being provoked himself — and there is a relentless enemy working on exactly that, 24/7. There’s no magic formula, but the pattern is consistent: the more time in the Word, in prayer, and in open-handed surrender, the less provokable a man becomes — and nearly every “rougher day” traces back to a day of coasting spiritually. Proverbs 19:11 describes the fruit: “Good sense makes one slow to anger, and it is his glory to overlook an offense.” A dad who sees the bigger, spiritual picture doesn’t take the bait — from the enemy or from a 9:30 p.m. toothpaste argument.
Takeaways for Dads
Talk about this with other men — ask a friend how conversation with his kids is actually going, volunteer how it’s going for you, and take the wild step of praying for each other; half the battle is discovering it’s not just you. And if you’ve provoked your kids more than you’d like to admit: don’t dwell there. Jesus has forgiven all of it — so start with repentance, go apologize, and move forward. One step at a time.
Scriptures From This Episode
Colossians 3:21 · Colossians 3:18–20 (the household context) · Proverbs 16:9 · Proverbs 19:11 · with a callback to the armor of God (Ephesians 6) from earlier in the series.
Go deeper: 5 Ways For Men To Lead Their Family · How To Leave A Godly Legacy For Your Children · Scripture on Family · The Lord Establishes You
Full Transcript — Not Quite There, Episode 5: Are You Encouraging or Discouraging Your Kids?
Mike: Okay, friends, family, countrymen, we are back For another week, another riveting episode here, brought to you today by Chris Howard and Michael P. Coltrane. That’s not my name at all. It can be. Uh how you doing today, buddy? Doing strong. Quite strong. Strong. Yeah. Some hesitation there. Well, yeah. Like doing strong.
Chris: You lifted at the gym today? No, no lifting. No. No. Good solid day of Digital marketing.
Mike: The opposite of lifting in the gym.
Chris: Okay. Yeah, more sitting. Mental lifting. Mental lifting. You’re probably squatting though while you were on the computer. Squatting quite a bit, yes.
Mike: Yeah. Do you sit on a medicine ball ever, like at home on a computer? I don’t engage my core with the medicine ball. Do you have friends that do that? I know some people who use that as well. No friends that I would call friends. Hmm, no medicine ball. So I have this ulcer in my mouth right now. You know when you like bite a section of your gums or whatever and you get one of those mouth ulcers? I’d
Chris: Do you know what I’m talking about? I haven’t bitten my gums, but can’t you bite your you’ve never bitten the inside of your mouth? I’ve bitten the inside of my mouth, I just haven’t bitten my gums. Okay.
Mike: What is the section that lines the inside of your mouth? And aren’t those Isn’t my gums? I bite my cheek often. Isn’t your are there gums on the inside? I guess I guess that’s teeth, right? That’s not cool. All right. Well maybe we don’t go m the medical route today. Uh it’s not there. It’s the ulcer. The ulcer is throwing me off. If you see me crying over here while you’re talking What causes the ulcer?
Chris: What have you been eating?
Mike: I guess I bit my gum. I don’t know what I bit. Okay.
Chris: I was probably aggressively too hungry. Any um any estimation on when that ulcer will
Mike: Clear up and check with the doctors. What do the doctors say? Uh I don’t know, probably like a day or two. Okay. Like when it’s like really painful, so it kinda hurts to talk. Not really uptown problems, but No problem. No. We’re talking a long time about my ulcer. I brought it up. I shouldn’t have brought it up. Okay. Okay. We’re being real. This is real talk. Real talk. Real talk. Guy talk. Real talk. We are uh what are we talking about today?
Chris: Today we’re gonna be talking about not provoking our children. Boom.
Mike: This is a big topic. It really is. This seems like a really popular topic amongst I mean a lot of dads out there. I hear a lot of dads talk about this. Actually, I hear a lot of dads talk about what in the world does it even mean to provoke. But that passage out of Colossians 3.
Chris: 21. This is the ESV version. I know there are other words that come into play from other versions of the Bible or other translations.
Mike: Other translations. Yeah. That’s another episode probably. Do you know some of those other words? Uh the other transl oh the other words in provoke. Let’s see we got provoke in what version do you you read your version?
Chris: My version is the ESV. You already said that. And it actually says You’re gonna say it again.
Mike: As ESV?
Chris: This is ESV.
Mike: Okay, here we go.
Chris: Yes. Fathers do not provoke your children. So that’s that’s my word, provoke. Yep. What what are some of these?
Mike: Is that the whole verse?
Chris: Oh I can I Oh okay.
Mike: You’re just gonna read half of the that’s fine. It’s oh you know what? Actually we we can just cherry pick verses, you know, the full verse and context of the Bible.
Chris: Let me give you the biggest thing. I’m really feeling generous right now. Fathers do not provoke your children. lest they become discouraged. That’s Colossians three twenty one. Fathers do not provoke your children lest they become Discouraged. Discouraged. Lest a lot?
Mike: Uh no, I’m not a big lessed guy. Lest. Don’t really go lest. Nope. Nope. Not part of my vocab. Let’s see, provoke. I think some versions say embitter. Uh exasperate. Yes. That’s a good thing. That’s a fun word. Yeah. So almost like you say Chris, how are you doing on exasperation of human beings? I mean, like that’s not really something we say. Yeah, no, I’d probably get it wrong. Also provoke is really not a common word. It’s really not. So unless we’re like picking a fight, I guess we say provoke.
Chris: Do you feel like we’re starting from behind here? We definitely got off on some tangents.
Mike: We probably need to get back on the right track.
Chris: Nice. Okay, let’s focus. What were you gonna say? I was gonna say I just feel like these are words that we don’t normally use. So break it down for for the the every man, for the the the layman
Mike: So to my knowledge, I’m not the expert here, so you tell me what you think too. So to my knowledge, provoke, embitter, exasperate is kind of Um, especially with our kids, fathers with our kids, which I think we might read a couple of verses around this, but um is it’s It’s discouragement like at a deep level. Like so the opposite of discipleship. You know, we’re we’re trying to raise our kids or disciple people, learn more how to follow Jesus. trusting and obeying all the commands of the Lord. I think that word is it’s not like when our kids are convicted they did something wrong or they’re They’re repenting and maybe there’s a little bit of negative feelings like they’re a little discouraged. It’s not that type of discouragement. It seems to be when you You can you can communicate in such a harsh way to them. I mean you just stump them with their progress. Yeah. They’re d they’re just I mean, I don’t know, how would you describe it? It’s hard I don’t have like a five-word definition of That. How about don’t be a jerk to your kids lest you damage them for life. That’s good. So basically when it’s when you’re being a jerk. That’s that’s kinda what we’re gonna that’s the street.
Chris: I’m kinda thinking it’s it’s mm yeah, that’s what it’s capturing. So many words or less.
Mike: I mean we we talked about this uh me and m my uh small group not too long ago, just kind of this passage, and a lot of people it there seemed to be different definitions of what it meant uh provoke. So so when you’re you’re reading this, like your takeaway with in your family is don’t be a jerk. Yes, I’ll stick with that. Yeah. I think it’s it’s hard. I think we probably all dads out there have different viewpoints on this a little bit. I don’t know how to describe it. I feel like I can tell when I’ve communicated to Matthew or Payton for me. in a way where like I’ve I’ve shut them down. Like you just you just like I don’t know you feel it you walk away and you’re like I I was a jerk. Yeah. I guess that’s what I’m thinking. Yeah. Yeah, ’cause you know like you didn’t have that conversation with them. You did the quick fix of either yelling at them or saying a couple of harsh words or sending them off to their rooms. You’re not explaining anything. Um, you’re not doing um you you’re just not discipling them.
Chris: Yeah. There’s nothing really good coming out of it, no, no good result.
Mike: So okay, we we’re kind of talking talking to death on like provoke, kind of what it what it means. I mean translation, don’t be a jerk. So that’s that’s the Chris Howard uh translation. That is the Chris Howard translation. On Amazon. It’s interesting in Colossians, like if you kinda read the context, you know, it it’s You got the role of the husband. And you know, love your wife. Do not be harsh with them. You talk about the wives submitting to their husbands as fitting to the Lord. These are, you know, verses 18, 19, 20. Children obeying your parents And then fathers, you know, obviously mothers shouldn’t provoke their children either, but this specifically is calling out our role as as men, as fathers. Why do you think it calls out fathers for that? Like I’m just curious.
Chris: This is just my opinion, right?
Mike: Yeah.
Chris: But it’s a safe place here. It’s just you and me. Yeah, no one’s no one’s listening. It’s okay. Yeah. Um I think it’s because of the role that we are designed to play within that family unit. Uh you know, we we know that as a husband we are to lead our wives, we’re to lead our families. And uh I think that the words that can come from us and the actions that can come from us um can probably hit with a little bit more force, if not applied well. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And so therefore knowing that, and God knowing us, knowing his design over us. Um, knows that we can cause a lot of damage as far as in the things that we say and the things that we do and um you know, left in the hands of somebody who’s responsible with that. Um, it unfortunately falls onto our children and can fall onto our wives as well.
Mike: So I mean it’s heavy because it on one end, like when you say that, it kinda makes me take a deep breath. And it’s like, okay, great, no pressure. We just have a lot of weight behind. But I’m also kind of encouraged too, because then there’s then there’s obviously power through our roles, like the way God’s designed it, that we We could provoke our children, right? We could be a jerk, we could stop them down, but then on the bright side of that, there seems to be something really powerful there if we really do step into discipling them. The effect we the effect we could have, yeah, on the flip side.
Chris: Yeah, there could be a lot of positive that comes from encouraging or leading our children through Um, you know, n knowing that we’re we’re helping to guide them through any kind of imperfection, any kind of mistake that they make, that if we do so in a kind and loving way that’s restoring them. Um and then also Giving them a real um view at sin and its repercussions, but also the the restoration That’s found within, you know, forgiveness and within mercy, then you know, we’re really modeling to them something good that could have lasting impact on them too, that they take into their families.
Mike: That’s good. What what’s an example like for one for for us Because obviously, you know, we’re no experts. I know you’re an expert at parenting, but I mean, you know, we’re we’re not, so I’ll I’ll just speak for us. But uh one of the some of the most powerful moments we’ve had is When I apologize to our kids and I don’t remember this growing up and maybe my parents did this once or twice. It was not a common practice. And it wasn’t for Joelle growing up either. But when I come back and I own I may not say, hey Matthew, sorry I provoked you earlier. Like I’m not really exasperating. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I’m not gonna do that. And and my son has a high-pitched voice like that. Thank you. What’d you do? Yeah. What? So But whenever I come back and go, hey, I’m sorry, maybe like I lost my cool. I shouldn’t have communicated that way. That wasn’t loving. Like I’m sorry, will you forgive me? Those moments, like I’ve never, you know, when you’re looking at your kid and they give you this big-eyed kind of deer in the headlight, they’re like, I’m listening to everything you’re saying at that moment. And so sometimes when I read this passage, I’m like, okay, when I own it and I take the extra time to talk, you know, especially late at night, it could be a one-minute conversation, or sometimes it’s a 30-minute conversation. And you don’t you don’t always feel like you have it in you. But when we have the longer talks or I apologize, and they kinda go to bed like, huh, like thinking then I don’t know in a way I feel like that would be the opposite of provoking them, right? Like is that be discipleship. Like what’s what’s how have you seen that for you?
Chris: Well news flash number one, I’m not a perfect parent.
Mike: What’s surprising? Matthew, was that you?
Chris: I’m not a perfect husband. Um So none of us are.
Mike: Not quite there, not quite there, eh? Exactly. That was a good one.
Chris: Oh So uh the way that I’ve seen that play out, very similar um with my daughter uh when I have had those moments of hey You know, I didn’t mean to uh respond that way or mean to say it that way. Uh, when I can tell that uh something that I said has hurt her feelings. Um Yeah, I she she’s looking at me. Yeah. You can tell that this is registering. Yeah. It’s almost like my my parent uh person is having this really uh deep moment here with me and uh is that her inside voice she’s saying my parent my parent burst burst my parent
Mike: She doesn’t know your name. She doesn’t know to say dad. She just goes my parent person.
Chris: The dad man is uh He’s really being deep and introspective right now. But no, uh seriously she she’s picking up on it. Yeah, okay. Um and I believe those are the real moments there. Those are the the moments where you can feel, okay, I’m actually parenting Yeah. I’m not just, you know, saying go here, do this, do that. You know, it’s the real parenting moment of I’m engaging with my daughter. She’s seen a real person here. She’s seen my need for Christ. Um, and then that’s what we end up talking about too is the the forgiveness and mercy. And there have been times where I’ve asked her, okay, would you forgive me and for that? And so you know you go through that together too. Has she ever said no? No.
Mike: Okay. Our kids haven’t either. I’m just curious. ‘Cause I asked the same thing, but now that I’m saying that out loud, like right now, I’m like What if they say no I won’t of course there’ll be a there’ll be another I’ll just be like go to your room you can tell where I was going with the answer That’s what it’s not to do, everyone. Okay, so Let’s help other dads out there. I mean, we need the help, obviously. Um and I think a lot of dads are like, yeah, I don’t want to provoke my kid. And I actually really do think we have something in us that we walk away from those rougher conversations and we’re like, I just did it. Like I just I just shut them down. Like And sometimes it feels insurmountable to go back and do it. So let let’s Let’s not worry about the past, right? There’s grace. Um going forward, what are like some warning signs you think for you if you’re slipping towards provoking or maybe even a couple of early signs when you’re like, nah, I think I’m more discipling. Like like how do you how do you see that? Signs of uh provoking. Yeah, like either either side. So like let’s say let’s say we’re trying to mutually like for for me and you or for other dads listening What are good warning signs before it gets a little too late that you might be stepping into provoking?
Chris: I think uh maybe the reaction of our children prior to us even saying anything. Um you know, if they’re being deceitful, if they are um you know, hiding any kind of indiscretion there, if they are, you know uh uh afraid to even say that they’ve m messed up or or made a mistake, then I think we’re already down that path of having gone a little bit too far. They they don’t want us to come down on them. They don’t want us to be uh upset at them. So I think that’s that’s a good road traveled a little bit too far.
Mike: So that’s o you’re almost saying the fact they’re already treating us that way. Right. Or the fact that you could be treating their dad that way is like they’re afraid to share everything. Like there there’s there’s already been an atmosphere maybe displayed of You know, my dad’s gonna blow up at me. He’s gonna do something. I mean, obviously k any kid could hide, and you could have the perfect dad and the kid could still hide, but you’re oh you’re almost saying like it’s like on the regular
Chris: Then on the other extreme there I would say it’s them looking to provoke back and yelling back, you know what or you know, uh getting a little bit more uh like we say in our if there’s you know, SAS, you know, that’s if you start seeing that more then I think you’re going you’ve gone a little bit too far too because, you know, your child feels like they have to challenge you in order to Uh maintain or to top.
Mike: Or or if they do maybe not bite into the temptation to to have Sass right back. You know, sometimes I feel like I I feel like I do better so when our kids if they kind of blow up at me I mean ’cause it’s so outrageous, sometimes it kind of makes me strangely calm because it’s it’s like, okay, this is clearly like I’m not gonna bite into this But I feel like my moments are like when I’m it sounds so bad, but I mean just to be real, it’s just I’ve had a long day or I’m stressed about something and it’s like they’re doing they’re arguing, you know, or they’re doing something that I’m in my flesh, I’m like, this is so annoying. You know, there’s there’s something that’s bothering me. then I feel like I then I blow up. Yeah. You know, I’d be like working in my office and they’re screaming in the background, then you’re like, All right You know, like it’s it’s That’s when I I guess it’s just my sinful, selfish self that they’re interrupting me, which this sounds really hard to say, but I guess it’s when they’re When I think they’re interrupting me or getting in the way or annoying me, the last thing I want to do, like my flesh, the last thing my flesh wants to do is disciple them. Yeah. Like I just want to
Chris: I don’t know, a quick fix. But you’re not making a conscious decision. I’m gonna go provoke my child.
Mike: No, yeah. I don’t wake up in the morning and go. Who could I exasperate today? Like my children. That’d be wonderful. No, it’s just my selfishness and um my lack of intentionality to want to disciple them. Like if I’m gonna be honest in those moments, I just I don’t want to. Right. And and Even if I say I want to, uh, my actions will show otherwise. And I think as men, you know, we’re called to we’re called to initiate, take the first step. You know, in our homes, everyone has responsibilities. Our wives have responsibilities, our kids have responsibilities. But at the end of the day, I mean we’re called to step first and sacrifice. I mean we’re we’re the example of Jesus to the church. You know, our wives are uh the church, the bride, and this is other passages in scripture, in fact check us on all that. But there is there’s something powerful that we can do as fathers to take that first step to model that discipleship to our kids. And like you said, the scary side is If we are uh selfish and we don’t see the bigger picture there, which is what Jesus has done for us, you know, if if we don’t if we don’t think of the cross, I think, in a daily way, I d I don’t know. I think we’re gonna find ourselves provoking kind of left and right just because we’re we’re man, we’re just we’re just selfish, you know?
Chris: I think so. I think it reverts back to how we were feeling at the time and you know, what we want. We want there to be quiet or we want them not to argue or, you know, if Uh, you know that your wife has had a a tough day. You don’t want her having to hear the kids argue too and cause more stress for her. I mean, there’s a lot of different situations there, right? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But what would happen if the kids saw a calm version? of you addressing them, yeah, saying, you know, in a calm voice Yeah. You know, put on whatever voice you need you can’t.
Mike: I guess it’s soothing, like a Barry White. Like Barry White. Your Barry White. You know, well that’s that’s a great point because the times we’ve been I’m I’m gonna say supernaturally calm because I just I’m not I know it’s not my flesh, like I know it’s the Holy Spirit within me. The times I’ve been calm to teach them and disciple them, and let’s say even apologize first. That’s where it’s like, you know, three days later, one of them will come to me and out of nowhere and just be like, you know, hey dad, I’m sorry I did blank. Will you forgive me? And of course on the inside I’m like Oh yeah, like I’m I’m pumped. But then of course on the outside it’s like, well, thank you very much. Thank you. But you’re right. I th they’re gonna take cues they’re gonna take cues from us. You know, I don’t see how any of us are gonna do this without reflecting on Jesus. And I know that sometimes sounds like the perfect Christian answer. I just know I know for me, I have to daily, I mean daily, maybe every five minutes, continue to die to my my wants and desires. I don’t know how to do that. without looking to the cross because then I see how big the cross is, how much Jesus has done for me. And then I’m like, well now I want to lay down my life for my family. You know, so I I so may I don’t know, maybe an encouragement uh in whether it’s for us or for other dads is, you know, how much time are you really spending with Jesus or even developing that relationship. Just because if it’s a five minute thing each day and that’s all you’re doing, the odds are between your marriage, kids, job, I don’t know, traffic, uh, whatever it is that’s gonna take place. It i it’s almost like we don’t even have a
Chris: You’re leaving yourself out there.
Mike: Yeah, yeah, there’s no chance, right? How I mean of course we’re gonna provoke everyone around us, probably at that point. What do you what do you think what’s a good takeaway for you? Like you you read a passage like this, you know, and then within the context, like
Chris: Slow down. Yeah. Really. When we think about it. Although very um the the very pace of life that we’re in right now, um there are so many things that we can concentrate on. There’s so many things that get our attention, there’s so many things that feel like they need to uh be addressed, you know, fires to put out, things to think about for tomorrow. Uh we’re in such a pace. None of those things are as important as God in our relationship with him. Yeah. And so having that uh that trust that even if I don’t think about this thing that it feels so important, whether it’s a business thing or whether it’s a a concern that we have for family and whatever is getting our attention. That time spent with God is that much more important. And He allows you to take those things to Him. Where our, you know, our penchant is to go ahead and try to figure it out ourselves, right? Sure. Yeah. That’s up to us. We’re gonna figure this thing out. Yeah. How much better if left in his hands in those times that we spend with him? And again, you’re right, not just you know, five minutes you know in the morning, but or whenever during the day, but constantly throughout. Those um you know y uh uh giving him access. Um he could take access, I know that. Yeah, yeah, he knows.
Mike: Well no, no, I know what you mean. I mean well you’re right because He well, here’s the deal. He knows. Like he knows what’s on your heart. He knows what’s on my heart. It’s kind of funny because I mean we’re talking about fathers. We know most of the time what’s going on in our kids’ lives before they come talk to us. We just want them to come be honest to us. We already know. So obviously God God would have to know. If he doesn’t know, he’s not God. So that’s that’s obviously not gonna make sense. He knows. So it’s kind of funny that we hide, like you said, like we think we’re not giving him access. And he’s like, I I know. Come tell me about it. But he’s not he’s he’s obviously doing it in a perfect loving way, not provoking us. Which is always the model we we truly have. You know, J Jesus is not exasperating us. Um and and I like what you said on handing those things over. to God. And I’m always kinda curious how people do that, you know, because that can mean a lot of things when when someone says that. Like, you know, for me it’s sometimes either writing out or thinking through what are all my concerns or worries or my to do list. Sometimes visually looking at it. And then praying through those things and going, okay, God, my hands are open. Today’s really about your to-do list. It’s really your calendar today, really not mine. I’m sorry for when I when I think it’s about mine. we just help just help establish my steps. Like I feel like I got a lot of plans and probably some of them are probably godly and a lot of them probably aren’t. But it seems like if I can each day go, okay, can you just direct my steps? I’m gonna focus on the person in front of me or the task at hand and my family right in front of me and just I really want to disciple them well. Just we just please help me. I think I think that could be not the only way. I think that could be a way. we could hand something over. That’s a great way.
Chris: I think that’s a great way and and uh you you provide a good picture of what that can look like. Um kind of go along with that. One of the things that I’ve been asking is, you know, show me the path forward. And that’s all I’m really asking. I’m not asking to know everything about it. I’m not asking, you know, for an answer, but a path forward. You know, what are those next steps like you mentioned? And so and I think that’s uh That ends up being a reasonable thing to be able to ask um when God asks us to, you know, with our plans.
Mike: Is it Proverbs is it Proverbs 423 Let me look this up for a second. 423, uh nope, that’s not it. That’s keep your heart with all village uh Also
Chris: Piece of advice.
Mike: Yep, it is. Uh so I’m blanking on it. I think it’s maybe Proverbs sixteen nine. Sorry. I didn’t I didn’t have this ahead of time, but Um yeah, there we go. Proverbs 16:9’s kind of been a banner verse for me lately. The heart of man plans his ways, but the Lord establishes his steps. So the reason the reason I like that a lot is There’s there’s two things and I think this has to do with uh not provoking our kids too, ’cause it’s it feels like a daunting task. Like it kind of feels like, oh Okay, no pressure, just you know, be perfectly patient with my kids forever. Well, I think if you think that way, which sometimes I’m guilty of, like that’s just gonna overwhelm us and most men are just gonna check out and they’re not even gonna engage. So don’t think of it that way. You know, the heart of man plans his ways, as scripture says, but the Lord establishes his steps. Which I think that’s two things. One, it means you have to get up from the couch. You have to take a step. Because we often will sit there and go, God show me, show me the way. And and we’re like, he’s never telling me anything. And it’s like, okay, if he says, I’ll establish your steps. It gotta make a step. Yeah, you gotta get up. You have to take a step, like get going. And if you’re like, I don’t know where to go, start walking. Yeah. You’ll establish your steps. But then like you said, he’s establishing our steps. Not necessarily a five-year plan, a 10-year plan. He could give us a big vision for that. That’s fair. But I think more often than not, it’s in the daily, I mean, minuscule steps. Which can feel overwhelming maybe if we feel like we need to get all the answers, but that’s also really encouraging to me because I can kind of step back and take a deep breath and Just be like, okay, the next next couple steps.
Chris: Yeah, I imagine you’ve seen this too, is that as you’re handing that over to him, as you’re asking for him to determine your steps and you’re going through your list of you know things that you’re you’re Well, hoping to work through with him, it really becomes apparent what’s more about you and what’s more about him.
Mike: Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah, that’s a good yeah, you’re right, ’cause it’s it’s kind of a scary prayer sometimes ’cause you realize at least for me, it’s like eight out of the ten things. that are weighing heavy on me, like sometimes have nothing to do with the Lord.
Chris: For example, yeah, something along the lines of, okay, well, you know, I want this to happen and I’m praying about this because Um it will make me feel more comfortable and secure. Yeah. And then you’re reminded. Yeah. Our security and our comfort is to be in the Lord. Yeah.
Mike: And we don’t even necessarily think it’s for our comfort and security, but sometimes like we don’t necessarily wake up and go, I want to be you know, comforted with my security. But then when yet like when you pray about it, it’s like, oh, this is just about me and my comfort and security.
Chris: And something else that you know than in. Holy Almighty God. It becomes pretty apparent. One thought too, Mike, is that the I’m glad you said my name. Thank you. Yeah. Be glad we’re sitting here.
Mike: I’m glad you said that. Thank you, Chris. Co-host Chris.
Chris: I just want to be clear, nobody else is in the room here. So to not provoke our children, to not provoke our wives, to not provoke uh our neighbors, our friend, whomever. Yeah. We need to not be provoked. And there’s certainly an enemy that’s looking to provoke us on a regular basis. What are those steps that we need to take to not be provoked ourselves?
Mike: Well, that’s a good that’s a good point. Um, because I bet we out of our reactions to that, we just we provoke right back. Or around us, right? Is that kind of what you mean? Like like we get provoked first and then it’s like, bah, like as far as a thing. I mean, no magic formula to this. You know, I think spiritual warfare, you can’t read the Bible and and walk away um believing that there’s not, I mean, just a war raging around us all the time. I mean, that’s language the Bible uses, not not our opinions. Again, fact check us. But it is all over scripture. And so we do have a relentless enemy. And we’ve talked about the uh armor of God, I think, a couple episodes ago, but Um, I just know if we think we’re gonna check Jesus off of a list. And he’s something to do for a couple minutes. You know, some people say quiet time, which is fine if you’re really using that time with the Lord. Sometimes I don’t like that label. Because it just is like, I’m gonna go have my I’m gonna go do my thing with Jesus and check, I’m good for the day. Well, the enemy is coming after us 24 seven. And so if we’re not going after Jesus 24-7, I mean it’s already lopsided. Yeah. So I don’t know how to, I don’t know the perfect answer to that question, and I don’t know how to perfectly Stay protected against being provoked. I just know the more I’m in his word, the more I’m praying, the more we’re doing open hands like we talked about, like kind of giving things over to the Lord. the less provoked I seem to be. Seems like the Holy Spirit will come up more often. And then like 10 out of 10 times when I have a more Rougher kind of a day, more rougher, that’s a word. When I have a rougher day, I coincidentally was not really thriving with the Lord that day. Like almost every single time. So I mean there there’s something there. If we’re not cultivating that relationship. Um, I don’t know how you know, yeah, I don’t I don’t know. I think that that would be that that that’d be my answer on okay how to not get provoked. Because also then when the provokes come, you don’t get offended. Like you just you you go um Proverbs also we’re talking about a lot of Proverbs today. Proverbs talks about good sense makes one slow to anger and it’s to his glory to overlook an offense. I think you have a lot more good sense in you You’re slow to be offended by whether it’s your kid or someone else coming at you and you see the bigger picture like you see the spiritual picture of what’s going on
Chris: Yeah, I think that’s the key there too is just the ability to see the big picture to be reminded of God and uh what he wants for us, what he wants for our family, what he what he wants from us personally. Yeah. And you know the the different venues he gives us to be light for him and to uh you know to reach people for him and if we’re constantly in ourself and constantly uh just not tuning in to God and what he wants for us, then of course that’s gonna get selfish right away. Yeah. And we’re going to we’re gonna be provoking. We’re gonna be provoking a lot of kids. We’re gonna be provoking
Mike: Just kids everywhere. So final takeaways would be uh your translation, the Chris Hour, the CHT is do not be a jerk.
Chris: Do not be a jerk to do that.
Mike: Do not be a jerk. And and where do we want to leave guys with today? We want to leave Whether you’re a current dad, your grandfather, not a dad yet, um, but provoking Yeah, so talk about these things with other guys that you know.
Chris: You know, ask uh your friend, you know, how are you doing? Uh you know how is conversation between uh you uh and your kids is it is it there? Um yeah. And you know, bring this some of this out into the open and be able to also volunteer how things are going. for you and you know, maybe take that wild step of committing to pray for each other.
Mike: That’s that’s a good word because I think something we’re finding as a theme as I’m like saying this out loud is How many guys struggle with the same things and how many guys also don’t talk to each other about it? But then once you do, you go, Oh, okay, cool. It’s not just me. Like you’re you’re you’re encouraged because we can mutually uh spur each other on to love and good works. And it’s so funny ’cause it seems so elementary, like, of course we should do that, but we just don’t do that. But I don’t know a dad who would not read this verse and not be challenged by it like in a good way. So yeah, I think d don’t dwell on the negative or what you’ve done. If you’ve yelled at your kid or provoked uh your child 99% of the time and you’re, you know, even listening to this. D m move forward. You know, like what Jesus has done is forgiven you for all past, present, and future sins. So he’s not dwelling on it. So you shouldn’t dwell on it. And if you have, man, start with repentance. Go apologize. Like just just what do you have to lose? I mean, the only thing that would stop you from apologizing to your child is your pride. And that You’re just gonna teach them that pride’s a good thing by doing that.
Chris: Yeah. And then your child might you know if you come and apologize and it’s been, you know, uh a g good build up of, you know, things that you feel like you’ve done wrong and provoke in your child and you end up apologizing to them and they get to see that from you and have that modeled for them. They might just say, you know, my dad person’s uh, you know, they’re pretty real. My d my dad person. My dad person is uh all right. So if it’s 9 30 at night and the kids are arguing over, you know, who gets the last little squeeze of toothpaste or who gets to pet the dog uh before bed and uh they start to arguing and you’re just all
Both: No! No!
Mike: That is You might be provoked. That’s not that’s exactly what not to do. That’s the definition of provoking at its best. Don’t be a jerk. No! Don’t be that guy. No! Don’t pull Michael Scott.
Chris: But, you know, take a little bit of uh of time there. You know, take a deep breath. Give that over to the Lord. Yep. And uh you should be back on your way.
Mike: Yep.
Chris: One step at a time, people. All right. Yay!
Outro: Thanks so much for joining us. Please consider rating and reviewing our podcast and hitting subscribe on whichever platform you prefer. Remember to keep moving forward because we’re not quite there.
