Don’t Tell Me to Be Patient
The waiting is the hardest part. We just don’t like having to be patient and if we are honest, we don’t want to be dependent. We are raised and taught to be independent, but is that really the best thing for us? There’s so much development that takes place through patience and it’s crucial to be honest with God in the process. He is always present and faithful and brings about the good through us in the midst of waiting.
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Why is it so hard to be patient? Mike Mobley and Chris Howard land here: waiting exposes how badly we want to be in control. Impatience is really a dependence problem. We want the driver’s seat, and God keeps putting us in the back seat. But He is just as present in the waiting as He is in the answer, and He uses it to build perseverance, character and hope (Romans 5:3–4). From Chris’s two-month stretch without signing a new client to Mike’s tearful, open-handed prayer about whether he would ever get married, they talk through Peter sinking on the water, John the Baptist’s question from prison, the idols hiding in a busy schedule, and what it looks like to wait well. Below: the key takeaways, the Scriptures discussed, and the full episode transcript.
Why We Hate to Wait: It’s Really About Dependence
Chris opens up about a hard season: on the heels of a kidney stone, he went two months in his digital marketing consulting work without signing a single new client. Nothing about his work had changed. He started to wonder if God was teaching him to be patient and have peace in the drought. Mike admits that even talking about waiting frustrates him. He wants to do and produce. Then he names what’s underneath it: waiting makes us dependent. We want to be in the driver’s seat, but in reality we’re in the back seat, and that feels like a demotion. Chris traces it all the way back to Eden, where the first sin was a grab for independence from God. Mike sees it in how awkward we get receiving a gift. We’d rather pay it back than simply receive, which is exactly what the free gift of salvation asks us to do.
“Don’t Ever Let Me Go”: Peter on the Water
Chris has been rewatching The Chosen during his waiting season. (Cue Mike’s tangent: as a SAG-card-carrying actor, he says cheesy Christian shows actually turned him off to Christianity before he believed, but The Chosen is worth a few episodes.) One scene undid Chris. In the show’s telling, Peter and his wife are struggling to conceive while Peter watches Jesus heal everyone else, and he pulls away. Then he steps out of the boat, starts to sink, and Jesus grabs him. Peter’s only words: “Don’t ever let me go.” That’s what dependence looks like. Chris shares that he didn’t grow up with a dad reaching out a hand to grab his, but he’s had friends and coaches who showed up, and moments where Christ lifted him up. Mike’s reminder: when we take our eyes off Jesus and start sinking, we can reach back out.
Even John the Baptist Had to Wait
Chris believes Jesus was using Peter’s struggle to prepare him for what was coming, when Jesus would be the only thing he could depend on. Even John the Baptist sent word from prison asking, “Are You the one, or not?” He was waiting for action. The crowds waited for Jesus to take the throne and overthrow Rome. The disciples woke Him up in the boat: why are You sleeping? Mike says we would do the exact same thing. But the Lord is near to the brokenhearted and a very present help in trouble. Chris adds that sometimes we think God is too busy for us, or that our repetitive prayers are a bother. He isn’t, and they aren’t. Whether you’re waiting on test results or something that feels trivial, God is the same in both. He cares.
Open Hands Instead of Closed Fists
Mike remembers the dating seasons when he prayed for a wife, watched relationships fall apart and obsessed over the timeline. The turning point was a hard, tearful prayer with open hands: God, You’ll provide or You won’t, and whatever You have in mind is best for me, whether or not I get married. He kept having to come back to that prayer. He did marry, and he says it would have been awesome either way. That’s the pattern in every waiting season: unclench the fist and put God back at the center. Mike is honest that idols aren’t always dramatic. Earlier that day, his own schedule getting out of whack was dictating his behavior. Chris raises his hand too. We pray “let this day be Yours” in the morning, then hit traffic and throw it all out the window.
What Waiting Builds
Mike has seen more rooted out of him in seasons of waiting than anywhere else. Chris points to patience and peace as fruit of the Spirit, then adds another P: perseverance. After a fumble trying to recite the progression from memory (and a stretch of honest dead air while Chris searches his phone), Mike finds it: suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope (Romans 5:3–4). Impatience builds none of that. It’s instant gratification. It loses hope because it only sees the present, and it makes everything about us: our timing, our priorities. As Chris puts it, it doesn’t build any muscles.
How to Wait Well: Time With God, Honest Prayer and Friends
When Chris’s wife and daughter took a mother-daughter trip to Disney World with his daughter’s dance company, he kept the TV off and spent the time in the Word, asking God to break any cycle of not depending on Him. (Mike insists that when Joelle and the kids are out of town, he is not eating a block of cheese on the couch.) Both guys pray out loud, Mike often in the car. Their takeaways: God has a 1,000% success rate, even when it’s not the result we expected. Fasting and prayer help us ask for, expect and obey the next step, even when that step is more patience. Chris called Mike during his hard stretch, and Mike spoke life and Scripture into it. Mike adds that it starts with honesty with God, even “God, You’re frustrating me.” Confession brings healing. And Chris’s closing word: nothing is impossible for God, He’s a Father who gives good gifts, and if you’re having a hard time waiting, don’t wait alone.
Scriptures From This Episode
Romans 5:3–4 · Galatians 5:22–23 (patience and peace as fruit of the Spirit) · Matthew 14:22–33 (Peter on the water) · Matthew 11:2–6 (John the Baptist’s question) · Mark 4:35–41 (Jesus asleep in the boat) · Matthew 5:3–12 (the Beatitudes) · Psalm 34:18 · Psalm 46:1 · Genesis 3 (the first sin as a bid for independence) · James 5:16 (confession and healing) · Matthew 7:11 (a Father who gives good gifts) · Luke 1:37 (nothing is impossible with God)
Go deeper: Fruit of the Spirit: Patience · Scripture on Patience · Depending on God · Keep Trusting Even When You Can’t See · Should We Pray For The Same Thing Over And Over? · Why Is It So Hard To Ask For Help?
Full Transcript, Not Quite There, Episode 12: Don’t Tell Me to Be Patient
Chris: It’s just that God is the same in those things as He is in the smaller things. So anything that you’re going through, anything that’s requiring patience, anything that is causing your spirit to be troubled, God cares.
Mike: All right, coming in hot. A new week. That means a new episode here on Not Quite There. Some people call it NQT.
Chris: NQT. Welcome to NQT.
Mike: That’s a very official Chris Howard voice right there, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome back, Chris.
Chris: Welcome back, Mike.
Mike: Good to see you back here in the studio. See your face.
Chris: Great to be seeing you. In person. It’s good to record in person versus, like, a Zoom.
Mike: I like it, right?
Chris: I like it. It’s better.
Mike: Yeah. We’re in person. We’re having coffee.
Chris: We are. You’re wearing comfy shorts. What are these shorts that you’re wearing?
Mike: We’re just going to keep looking at each other in our shorts when we start episodes. It is summer. They’re like a golf pair of shorts that someone told me about, but they’re the most comfortable shorts that I’ve ever had. I don’t know what brand. I don’t know anything about golf. Sorry. Confession. I’m not a big golfer. Do you golf a lot?
Chris: Are you saying “golf”?
Mike: Golf. Golf.
Chris: For some reason, maybe it’s my headphones.
Mike: Do you say… maybe I’m hearing… No, we’re not going to do this. Playing golf. That’s what people say. Golf. How do you say it? Golf, golf, golf. Yes. Fine. I’m saying it. A pair of shorts. They’re comfortable. Let’s move on from the shorts. I did have a question for you.
Chris: Yes.
Mike: I wrote down two things, actually. You did not know this ahead of time. Here we go. Do you say “coupon” or “cue-pon”?
Chris: Coupon.
Mike: Okay. Thank you. We’re on the same page there. Good. Also, what do you think about people who have full conversations on speakerphone in the middle of a crowded coffee shop?
Chris: I think I want to go to a different coffee shop.
Mike: The full speakerphone experience. It’s terrible.
Chris: It really is.
Mike: How good is that conversation going? The other person listening to all of it. There’s no way it’s effective.
Chris: Self-awareness is really low there.
Mike: I genuinely… this sounds like an old guy complaining now. I don’t understand. This happened the other day at Starbucks.
Chris: What did you do?
Mike: I just sat there and kept going. Just kind of pushed through it. But the whole time I’m not understanding how this conversation is happening.
Chris: What do you think is happening on the other end? Do you think they’re liking that?
Mike: I don’t. There’s no way. It can’t be an enjoyable experience.
Chris: I don’t think so. Right? No, it can’t be.
Mike: It’s crazy.
Chris: Yeah. My kids just… we don’t do it.
Mike: You don’t do it. Something else that is not enjoyable is sometimes making apologies. And who do we apologize to this week? Each week we have something or someone new to apologize to. What you told me before the show started, it sounds like we’ve got to apologize to a company.
Chris: Yeah. I found out that there are still over 562 active, working Winn-Dixie locations.
Mike: 562. And we thought they were out of this.
Chris: But Winn-Dixie does exist.
Mike: Are they in Texas?
Chris: I think so. I didn’t really follow them on the map, but I believe around here you might find a Piggly Wiggly. I said a Piggly Wiggly, Winn-Dixie, and maybe a Piggly Wiggly. We apologize, Winn-Dixie, officially.
Mike: Yes. Our many, many apologies. Do we have any other apologies?
Chris: I think we might’ve cast too broad of a paintbrush over the people of Boston.
Mike: Oh, Boston. Yes.
Chris: Maybe the accent’s dying down. Maybe there’s enough people that have moved up there. I know some Texans live up there. They’re not talking like that. But sorry, Boston. We were just a little bit hurt because of what you did.
Mike: So 562 locations of a grocery store, and also then basically the entire East Coast, we’re apologizing to you.
Chris: We’re going to have to make apologies every now and then.
Mike: Yeah. It’s fun. We’re going to do it.
Chris: So what’s been going on? Have you been watching these major soccer tournaments? You have the Euro, and then you have Copa América taking place. Have you been following that?
Mike: Well, I believe by soccer, you mean football.
Chris: Football. Yeah.
Mike: I just want to make sure you’re calling it the correct thing. No, I’m really not going to be helping golf fans or soccer fans here today. I don’t really follow soccer. I’m sorry. Have you been watching all of those?
Chris: You know, I have a slight interest in it. I’ve been to, like, an FC Dallas and an Austin FC game. Does that count?
Mike: You’ve seen soccer. It’s like going to Chili’s. “I’ve had food.”
Chris: I’ve been to a soccer sport.
Mike: It’s a match.
Chris: It’s a match on the pitch.
Mike: On the pitch. Yes. Oh, Ted Lasso. I like Ted Lasso. I’ve been watching Ted Lasso. Basically, I know soccer.
Chris: You’re doing your part for the soccer community. I’m just wondering why it’s not as popular as it could be in America, in a country that just seems to get behind sports and throw a lot of money toward it and a lot of attention. So why do Americans think soccer is lame, basically?
Mike: Yeah. I think we have to collectively, because it’s not popular. I don’t know. There’s a lot of running around. You’re kicking a ball.
Chris: What would make it better?
Mike: Let’s see. Probably not a halftime show. Probably don’t need that. I mean, the game’s kind of long. Maybe you make it, you know, like the pitch count in baseball. Maybe they have to kick the ball or get past a certain line on the field in a certain amount of time, where there’s, I guess, even more offsides.
Chris: That’s not a bad idea. I actually like that better than my idea.
Mike: What was your idea?
Chris: Maybe, like, five minutes where they get to use their hands.
Mike: Five minutes. You can do whatever you want with the ball. I like that. Handball. You know what? Okay. I love the five-minute idea. “You can do anything you want with the ball” minutes. Also, you don’t know when the five minutes is going to start. It could be anytime during the match. It’s random. Once they blow a different type of whistle, it’s like, “Five minutes. Here we go.” That would actually be really entertaining.
Chris: I think so.
Mike: Because then I would tune in, because you don’t ever know what’s going to happen.
Chris: I think the people would love it.
Mike: If you were in the crowd during those five minutes, I mean, you’re going insane.
Chris: I’m thinking, “I can’t wait until five-minute hand time.”
Mike: It’s not just hand time, though. You can do whatever. Grab it, run with it. You could travel with the ball. Traveling’s the wrong sport.
Chris: Like a rugby scrum.
Mike: Oh man. Yeah. I would be interested in that.
Chris: Not going to lie, they’d probably have to rename the sport, though.
Mike: Soccer. Ultimate soccer.
Chris: That was one of the worst uses of dead time we’ve ever had.
Mike: Maybe it has to do with the subject that we’re going to talk about.
Chris: Good segue, my friend. You are a professional. The problem is you’re waiting for somebody to score a goal, and sometimes they don’t score a goal. Sometimes it’s 90 minutes of waiting. And there’s no shootout unless it’s a game where somebody has to win and advance. But yeah, it could just be a real bummer that you see no scoring, and you’re waiting.
Mike: You’re kind of putting me to sleep talking about all this soccer. It sounds really like an enjoyable 90 minutes.
Chris: That’s a wonderful time, right?
Mike: Let’s go watch some soccer.
Chris: All that to say, waiting is, as a famous philosopher said, the hardest part, right? A little Tom Petty. So do you remember a time in your life where you just had to wait for a result, or wait for something?
Mike: I mean, when you tell me right now we’re going to talk about waiting at all, I’m probably already a little frustrated on the inside, because patience, waiting… I don’t want to wait. I don’t even want to think about this. I want to do things or produce things. Waiting, or slowing down, or sitting still, that’s challenging for me. I’ve got to think about a specific time, because I hate all of them.
Chris: So I don’t think it’s something that we do naturally. Patience, I believe, is a struggle for you.
Mike: It is. Yeah, it is. And you’re, like, a patient person.
Chris: Don’t let that fool you, because over the past two months I’ve had to be very patient on some things. One of the things we’ve been talking about here has been the kidney stone, and number one, to find out what that was.
Mike: Kidney stone update. Do we have a latest update? You said last week it was passed.
Chris: I haven’t had any issues, so I’m thankful to be on the other side. But yeah, once you find it out, then you’re trying to get rid of the thing. And then, since we started the podcast, not many people know this. Maybe you’re one of the only ones, or at least a few that know this. But since the podcast started… you know, I’m in consulting for digital marketing, and part of that role means that you’re signing new clients. And I haven’t signed a new client in two months, and it kind of coincides with the podcast.
Mike: No.
Chris: But it’s either coincidence or it’s providence there. Because as I really take a look at it and I’ve looked at, “Okay, well, what’s changed?” I don’t see any kind of smoking gun as far as, “Okay, well, I’m not doing that well.”
Mike: But you’re still doing your job.
Chris: I’m still doing the job. I’m still as attentive as I can be and looking to consult as well as I have, and I’ve never had a really big issue with performance there. But over the past two months, it’s been a drought. And what I’m thinking now is that maybe God’s trying to teach me how to be patient and have peace during that time. And so we’re talking about this today.
I think it’s going to be helpful for people out there who are also either waiting on something, whether that be medical test results, whether that be something related to their job, something for a family member, you name it. What are some other things that people wait for?
Mike: Well, you’re making me think of different seasons I’ve gone through and waiting, because, you know, we have maybe between the two of us a little experience under our belt these days. I mean, I don’t have as much as you, because you’re a little older than I am. You’re in AARP land. But job transitions come to mind for me. I mean, gosh, sometimes you’re waiting on a paycheck to come through, waiting on finances to come in, just to see results maybe in your health, physical health or mental health. It could be as simple as you’re waiting for it to be the end of the day, or to get through a really hard week, or just anything. I’m trying to think of other scenarios people have to wait on.
I don’t think we like to wait because it kind of makes us be dependent. You know, if we take control and we can do something in two seconds, well, we don’t have to wait. We’re in the driver’s seat. But in reality, we’re not in the driver’s seat. We’re more in the back seat. And even me saying that right now, I don’t want to be in the back seat. I want to be driving. So if I look at you and say, “Hey, in reality you’re in the back seat,” it almost sounds like a demotion, so to speak. So I think there’s something here on patience and that struggle and waiting that goes in line with our dependence.
Chris: I think that’s the key word there. As soon as you said that, I mean, Miles Finch saying, “Yes.” Oh, yes, of course.
Mike: You don’t even have to say it. We’ll just play it. Right there.
Chris: Because dependence, I don’t think we are naturally geared for that.
Mike: I don’t think so, right? We’re told to be independent. At least in the West, although I do feel like it’s kind of similar around the world, but I’m not an expert at this. I do think we’re raised to be independent.
Chris: I would say that’s what happened in the Garden of Eden there with that first sin. It had a lot to do with trying to break free, independence from God and His will and from the perfect environment. And so I think that’s just part of our sin nature too. We don’t want to have to depend on anybody, anything. I think our natural inclination is always going to be, I want to be in that driver’s seat, and I want to be able to know the timing of things. I want to be able to make decisions. As soon as I know that information, I want to move. I want to do.
Mike: Man, there’s something so true about that. I was talking with someone the other day about the free gift of salvation, and we were kind of breaking it down. Whether it’s a birthday or a celebration, a lot of us don’t even really like receiving a gift, because the attention’s on us. Like you just said, we don’t want to rely on someone. So when someone gives us a gift these days, I think we’re almost immediately like, “Oh, let me pay you back,” or you do something special for them two weeks after that, because you want to pay them back. But what if I want to give you a gift right now, and you cannot pay me back? I think there’s something that almost immediately makes you a little uncomfortable. But why is that? Why can’t we just receive a gift?
Chris: I don’t understand it. I would say that you don’t want to be in somebody’s debt. I would say that’s part of it too, that you don’t want to have to rely on somebody, or to say, “Okay, well, in order for me to get what I want, they have to provide it.”
Mike: I guess that’d be the same thing with patience for me. I don’t want to rely on someone else’s timing or schedule or priorities. At my worst, and it sounds terrible, I guess I want to control it, or I think I know better because it’s my timing. Some variant of that.
Chris: Yeah. But during the past couple months, I’ve kind of tapped into The Chosen series again. And I know The Chosen is not the Bible. It’s not the source. But it does have some really…
Mike: Can I go off on a tangent on The Chosen for a second? I just interrupted you. Sorry. You’re right, it’s not the Bible. But I like entertainment stuff, TV shows. Still an official SAG-approved actor, agents, if you’re listening. Just go to the IMDb. So there’s a lot of Christian shows and movies that factually could be talking about the Bible, and that can honor God. Let’s just say that as a preface.
Chris: Okay.
Mike: Can I just throw that out there? But the quality of the shows, where the scripts or the acting are terrible…
Chris: Like terrible.
Mike: The worst. They’ve been really bad. Let’s just put it that way. They’ve been so bad that before I was a believer, I remember watching some of them, and I actually thought that’s kind of what Christianity was, and it was really cheesy. It actually really turned me off, for real, to Christianity or the church, things like that. The Chosen is by no means perfect, but we are making strides. I would say to anyone, it’s worth your time to give it a few episodes. And if you’re like me and you’re like, “It’s another Christian show, there’s no way I’m going to watch it,” I would give this one a shot. This is different than the other ones. I don’t know if you agree.
Chris: I agree.
Mike: Sorry. I went on a whole tangent there.
Chris: I don’t think because you criticize some other Christian movies or shows, or even if you criticize any Christian music, that means that you don’t love God.
Mike: It sounds funny saying it. I know. Thank you for saying that. But some of them are bad.
Chris: Well, things have to be done with excellence, right? That’s one of our core values here at 121. It’s what we ascribe to. But in watching that show, there are two scenes in that series that have made me tear up.
Mike: They got you.
Chris: Yeah. The first one being when Jesus basically wakes up Matthew and says, “Okay, I’ve landed on what I’m going to say during this sermon on the mount.” And again, this is a spoiler alert here too, so for those who haven’t seen it…
Mike: Just turn it down.
Chris: But it is a very powerful scene. I think it’s worth talking about.
Mike: Never mind. Turn it back up. Turn it back up.
Chris: So He’s basically walking through the Beatitudes, and as He’s walking through each Beatitude, there are scenes of the disciples and time that He’s spent with them, things that He’s seen about them. So basically it’s supporting what He’s saying there. And it’s a powerful scene. It just shows Jesus’ care and His concern for the disciples.
Mike: Like He’s personalizing it. Because we don’t know what was really going through His mind when He was saying it, right? Which is why it’s kind of cool. They took liberties. Doesn’t mean it’s accurate. It could be. We don’t know.
Chris: It’s a beautiful picture of being a shepherd and of knowing your sheep.
Mike: It’s super thoughtful.
Chris: So that’s one scene there, but there’s another one that’s more related to what we’re talking about today. I believe it’s from an episode called “Sustenance.” The way they’re telling the story, it seems like Peter is having a hard time. He and his wife are having a hard time conceiving. And so he is seeing the healing that Jesus is doing for many others, and I guess he’s getting to a point where he’s wondering, “Okay, well, what about me? What about my wife? What about us and what we’re going to go through?” So you see him getting a little bit distant there, and that’s happening throughout the whole episode, and it’s causing some hardship between him and the disciples.
And then the powerful scene really comes when the disciples are in the boat out there on the sea, and Jesus approaches, and they think He’s a ghost at first. But basically He’s out there showing them His power. And Peter says, “Ask me to step out of the boat.” And as he’s stepping out of the boat, he starts to sink, and Jesus grabs him, rescues him. And Peter’s just basically telling Him, “Don’t ever let me go.” I can think of it and get emotional thinking about it, because it’s such a powerful scene of us and what we need, and what dependence looks like, and how desperate we should be for Christ.
Mike: Man. Why do you think he sunk when he was on the water?
Chris: Well, Jesus would tell him his faith was lacking during that time. He was taking his eyes off of Christ.
Mike: There’s something powerful about, at least for me, a grown man like that calling out. How much more of a, not dramatic, but strong example of dependency can we think of, whether it’s a kid or a grown-up, reaching his arm out and being like, “Don’t let me go”?
Chris: That’s powerful. And I can’t say that I grew up with the experience of a dad reaching his hand out and grabbing mine, and just the comfort that that must’ve been. A lot of people do have that experience of what that must feel like.
Mike: A lot of people don’t too. It’s a good mix, right? Some people have it. Some people don’t. We can have it with Jesus, and not everyone necessarily knows that. Or even as we follow Him, we forget that maybe. And maybe like Peter, we take our eyes off of Him and start sinking a little bit, until we have some moment that He gives us to remind us, “Oh, okay.” And then you reach back out.
Chris: Right. But I have had friends, I’ve had coaches even, where I understand what it’s like to feel encouraged and loved as a result of them taking that time to just say, “Hey, we’re here for you.” And then of course, I believe we’ll always remember the moments where we have felt like Christ has stepped in and has lifted us up and has given us that divine spiritual hug, that reminder that He’s there and that He’s not going to leave us, and that all we have to do is call on His name.
Mike: So when Peter was struggling, the way that episode showed it, or even just biblically, what do you think he was learning through that struggle, and maybe even through the struggle of being patient in his wrestling with the Lord? Do you think he was learning something, or the Lord was doing something with him intentionally through the patience? Does anything come to mind for you?
Chris: I think so. Basically what I believe Jesus was doing, and what I read, is that He was preparing him for what was to come. “There are going to be tough times ahead, and you really do need to focus on Me. I’m going to be the only thing that you’re going to be able to depend on.” So preparing him for that. And I also see it in other examples too, and I know you do too, with John the Baptist. He basically got messages to Jesus: “Are You the one that we have been expecting or not?” Because he was waiting for some action. He was waiting for things to happen. And Jesus answered him with, basically, answered prophecy. And that was very important, because what other man is greater than John? And even he had his doubts there.
Mike: Oh yeah. I think of the disciples and just the people in general, how many people were waiting, like, “Jesus, when are You going to take Your spot on the throne and overthrow the Romans, or write off the Pharisees?” Just waiting for this action. Even times when Jesus would withdraw and go pray, and the people closest to Him would be like, “Where are You going?” Or when He’s in the boat, another example, and He’s taking a nap.
Chris: Why are You sleeping?
Mike: Sleeping. I mean, what a great example of our lack of patience. I think we would do the exact same thing. We’d wake Jesus up today and be like, “What are we doing? Are we napping?” We would totally struggle with that. So it makes me think, in the midst of maybe thinking God’s not answering our prayers, or how long do we have to struggle with a physical element or a mental element, we’ve talked about anxiety and other things like that. Does it mean we’re going to have to have it forever or not? And in the meantime, “God, will You just deliver me, or hear me, or are You there?” Just that desperation kind of feeling.
Because we know He is there. Or at least I’ll just say, I know He’s with us. Even passages like “The Lord is near to the brokenhearted. He saves those crushed in spirit.” Even in the middle of a crisis, He’s just as present with us on those hard days as He is on our easier or good days, whatever you want to call them. He is a very present help in times of trouble. But it is interesting how often we just get impatient.
Chris: Yeah. He’s there no matter how we feel, right? Even if we feel like He’s not listening to us, or even if we feel like our prayers are just being repetitive, that doesn’t change who God is. Sometimes we might even view Him as, “Oh, He’s too busy. He’s over here doing something else.”
Mike: “I have to get His attention. He’s too busy for me. He probably has other responsibilities. I don’t want to bother Him with my life,” stuff like that.
Chris: Yeah. He just might need us to experience that much more dependence on Him. He might need it to take one week into two weeks, sometimes to eight weeks. And I’m not saying that what I’ve been through there, with the health and with the wealth, and we’re not talking Joel Osteen here…
Mike: We’re going to be apologizing next week.
Chris: I’m not trying to say that that compares to a lot of things that people are going through right now. There are certainly people going through some really excruciating, tough situations, and they’re waiting, and we’re not trying to make light of that at all. It’s just that God is the same in those things as He is in the smaller things. So anything that you’re going through, anything that’s requiring patience, anything that is causing your spirit to be troubled, God cares.
Mike: Oh yeah. It’s a big topic, because it does range from the most trivial things we could think of, trivial by the way, versus, yes, maybe a crisis. And He cares about all of them. I can think of one moment, and I hope this is heard the right way. When I was dating, just like many, many single people, you’re praying for your spouse. You want a husband or you want a wife, and you just really have the desire. You have a desire for a family, could be for kids, could be for whatever. And I remember going through multiple dating seasons, and you’re being patient, and you have some relationships and they don’t work out, and you’re just wrestling.
And I just remember praying, and I’m not saying it’s this easy, but I just remember finally relinquishing control, in my opinion. That’s how it felt. It felt like I was just obsessing over the timeline. When are things going to happen? When is it going to happen for me? And it was kind of putting my hands open and just praying, “God, okay, You know what? You’ll provide or You won’t provide for it, and it’s going to be the best thing for me. The results of what You have in mind are going to be the best thing for me, genuinely, whether or not I get married.” And it was a hard prayer. I’m not saying it’s easy. I think I was crying when I prayed it, because it felt like I was just giving over the desire. And again, I don’t want it to sound like it’s easy, because it’s not, and I probably had to keep coming back to that prayer.
And I did end up getting married, and that’s awesome. And it would have been awesome if I didn’t get married, right? Praise God for both situations. But I feel like I can recall multiple moments in these seasons of waiting where at some point I had to give over my closed fists wrapped around whatever the topic was. Relinquishing some type of control and putting Him back in charge and at the center, as He should be. Maybe I was sinking in the water, and I needed to look at Him and put my arms out for Him to grab me. And that was the best place for me.
Chris: I think that’s really it. Anything that becomes more important, or that we place more importance on, God doesn’t have time for rivalry, right?
Mike: Yeah. And I think we talked about this earlier. It’s a hard word, because that would be defined as an idol, but we do not call those idols, right? And I get it. I don’t call them idols in my regular day-to-day language. But an idol is defined as anything taking the place of God. So chances are, and I can only speak for me, throughout the day today I’ve probably had a handful of things that, as the day progressed, I kind of made an idol. In fact, I know I did. Some of it was my schedule and my tasks earlier today. I got a little bent out of shape that they got a little out of whack, and it was just my timing. But in that moment, my out-of-whack schedule was dictating my behavior. It’s a hard pill to swallow. That’s an idol.
Chris: No, and I could raise my hand on that too and say it affects me the same. We start the morning, and if we’re spending time with God in the morning, I know what we’re prone to say: “Let this day be Yours, and do whatever Your will is here.” And then as soon as it gets to our schedule, “I know, but that has to happen.”
Mike: Then we get in the car and we hit a little traffic on the way, and we’re like, “Okay, well, you know what? This is all out the window now.”
Chris: Yep. Start again tomorrow.
Mike: Yeah. That’s good. So there’s beauty to be found. It’s so hard. But there’s beauty to be found in the patience. There’s something about the Lord moving slowly, talking slowly, developing our character, developing a lot of things. And in the moments I’ve had to be patient, I think a lot of things have been rooted out of me in the process, more in those times than other moments. Does that make sense?
Chris: It makes a lot of sense. It’s from God. It’s a fruit of the Spirit, you know, patience, and the peace that He wants us to have. Even in the middle of the things that aren’t going well, He still wants us to have peace. And I believe the two are related.
Mike: They all kind of tie together as part of the fruit of the Spirit.
Chris: Yeah. And though it’s not listed as a fruit of the Spirit, let’s just throw another P in there: perseverance, right? This helps to build that perseverance when we’re actually practicing those two. There’s a lot of P’s.
Mike: Wow. There’s a lot of P’s.
Chris: A lot of P’s. But all those help to produce character. And I would say that character, what does that produce?
Mike: Is it godliness after that? What’s that progression? Do you know that off the top of your head? Perseverance produces character, produces steadfastness, and steadfastness producing godliness. Some of my biblical friends are going to correct us. We’ll be apologizing to the Bible.
Chris: We have Joel Osteen to apologize to. We have biblical scholars. And then who else are we on?
Mike: I don’t know. The list is growing. We are making a lot of enemies with the podcast. No, it’s perseverance, character. There are honestly different translations. You’re going to look it up.
Chris: I think it’s worth it. It’s Scripture.
Mike: All the words we’re saying are in there. Maybe in different orders. We’ve got perseverance, character, hope, steadfastness, godliness.
Chris: You’re talking about the fruit of the Spirit, right? What are you talking about?
Mike: I’m talking about perseverance. You know, sometimes we have a little dead air while we’re looking at each other and kind of laughing, and while Chris is playing with his phone, because he’s playing a game right now. Thanks for playing Minesweeper on your phone. But you know what? This is a real podcast, and sometimes we’re not going to cut out moments like this. I’m buying you time right now. You’re still on the phone. We’re going to get this right. What is it?
Chris: I can’t find it yet. Talk amongst yourselves.
Mike: I’ll give you a topic. “Not only so, but we also glory in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope.” That’s it. Some would say it’s Romans 5:3 through 4, NIV.
Chris: That is what I was looking for.
Mike: Okay. Just letting you know. Yeah, here it is. So no, you’re right. And the opposite, I guess, being impatient, just to kind of riddle that for a second, I guess would produce, well, you don’t learn how to persevere, because you’re impatient. Instant gratification. You want it now, now, now. And I guess when you’re not getting it, your hope is lost. You have nothing to look forward to, because you’re not forward thinking at all. You’re just thinking about the present and what you have or do not have.
Chris: It doesn’t build any muscles there.
Mike: And then I guess you’re not really developing your character, because in those moments you’re kind of making it about… I mean, this is hard. I’m saying this more to myself than anyone else, but you’re making it about you, right? It’s your selfishness, your timing. The priorities are off.
Chris: And you’ve kind of put yourself in a place where you’re the most important, right? You need to get what it is that you want at the time that you want it.
Mike: So how have you gotten better? I’m thinking about how to apply this for me and you and those listening as we end this, because it’s always good to ask, what’s the takeaway? If we don’t have a takeaway, if we’re not taking a next step… and we’ve talked about this, the whole point of this podcast is hopefully to mutually encourage each other. We’re not always going to be there, but if we’re taking a step, that’s all we can really do. So how have you either grown in patience, or what are you thinking about to help grow in your patience?
Chris: Well, the greatest gift over this time, I would say, is more time with God, because it has made me want to spend more time with Him, and has made me want to speak to Him, even audibly. My wife and my daughter had a chance to take a mother and daughter trip to Disney World with my daughter’s dance company. And that gave me time at home, and usually I would say that…
Mike: You lay around on the couch and eat a block of cheese with swim trunks on.
Chris: And just watch TV. Yeah, no, not at this time.
Mike: Oh no, it wasn’t the summer of Chris.
Chris: It wasn’t the summer of Chris this time. No, it was actually keeping the TV off and spending more time in the Word. And I’m not saying this as “look at me.” It was just needed. It was one of those things where I felt like this time was allowed for this. It was time to spend asking God questions, asking God to maybe break me out of any kind of cycle of not depending on Him, and having this unfiltered time with Him. And it was wonderful.
Mike: Were you actually talking audibly?
Chris: There were times where I was.
Mike: That genuinely helps me. I think when I first became a believer, I thought it’d make me sound like a crazy person. But when I’m praying and talking, there’s something about hearing it outside of my head that makes it more real to me. I feel like I’m actually conversing, because I’m talking audibly. I’ll do that in the car a lot. I’m sure people driving by are like, “What is this guy doing?” I guess they’re thinking I’m talking on the phone. But when I pray audibly at home too, it really makes a difference for me.
Chris: It does. I’m going to say, “Is that person looking over at me?” if I’m talking in the car. But pretty soon you just don’t care. You’re talking to God.
Mike: For the record, if it’s the summer of Mike, I just want to make sure everyone knows, if Joelle and the kids go out of town, I’m not eating cheese on the couch with my shirt off. That’s not what I’m doing.
Chris: Not even puffy Cheetos.
Mike: I know. Crunchy. Come on. We talked about this. I’m not a lazy guy. That was just an idea. I thought maybe you would enjoy that.
Chris: I enjoy that illustration here. But I know what it’s like to waste time. I know what it’s like to use that time just for me: “Hey, I’m going to watch what I want to watch, turn on the sports, and just eat what I want to eat.” But never satisfying, right?
Mike: Like when you eat a bunch of cheese. Just never satisfying.
Chris: Never satisfying when you know you didn’t spend time wisely.
Mike: I love right now how much you’re pushing through and talking about the meaningful substance, and for whatever reason I’m being the kid that keeps bringing up the cheese.
Chris: I keep punching holes.
Mike: I don’t know why this is happening, but you are pushing through so well. You are Swissing up that cheese. Oh, so good. That’s good.
Chris: Now, takeaways.
Mike: Takeaways. Yeah.
Chris: Several of them. I would say one of them being that God is going to come through. His character is not going to change. There is hope. We do have that.
Mike: He is unchanging. He comes through. A 1,000% success rate. He has come through every single time, for eternity. It has happened. It will always happen. That’s such a powerful reminder. It may not be the result we’re thinking, but He comes through in the way that’s better every single time, no matter what we’re going through.
Chris: Hands down. And then just a new appreciation for fasting and prayer. Asking for that next step, expecting that next step, and then being obedient to that next step that He reveals. That’s part of the reason why we titled this Not Quite There, because that’s what we’re talking about: just taking that next step forward wherever you’re at.
Mike: Even if that means more patience, right?
Chris: Even if that means, yeah, maybe a step back to take a bigger step forward, by being patient. So that’s another takeaway there. And then we need to invite others in. I would say that over that time, even with you, I’ve called you and let you know, “Hey, this is a pretty tough stretch right now.” And you, being the good, faithful friend that you are, really speaking life into the situation, and sharing Scripture, and reminding me about God, and offering the perspective that He gives you. So that’s rich. Having that community around you, being able to share, being able to open up about your struggles too. It puts the focus off of you and onto God when you have a community of people that love God, are loved by God, and then love each other as a result of that.
Mike: Yeah. I think the one thing I would add to that, like you’re saying on being honest as you’re talking to community and obviously not being isolated, is starting that or ending that with being honest with God Himself. He already knows what we’re thinking. He knows exactly what you’re struggling with. He knows you and I more than we know ourselves. And it’s funny, though, sometimes we hold back. Why don’t I want to say all that to God? Fill in whatever the reason is, but He knows. So it’s so much more freeing to just go, “Okay, God, I don’t want to be patient.” Maybe your prayer is like, “God, You’re frustrating me with this patience thing, and I don’t want to be patient, so I’m not talking to You for five minutes,” and you cross your arms and you’re all upset. But you’re at least saying something and showing some honest feelings.
When we are more honest in our prayers with the Lord Himself, I think it helps lead us to be more honest with others. And then there’s confession that takes place, and the Bible says there’s healing with confession. And what do you know? We probably take a deep breath, and we grow a little bit more in our patience. But it starts with that honesty. Holding it in is not doing us any good, even though we’re tempted to think we should hold it in and, quote, get over it. But the sooner we’re honest, I think the sooner there’s healing.
Chris: I agree, 100%. The big reminder for me here, and hopefully for you listening out there, and hopefully for you, Mike, is that there’s nothing impossible for God. There really isn’t. And He is a Father who likes to give good gifts to His children, and we just don’t know what those are going to be at times. And as children, we don’t have to know. Some of the best surprises we have as children are when we don’t know.
Mike: We don’t know.
Chris: But we do serve an amazing God. He loves us. And if you’re having a hard time waiting, just don’t wait alone. He can do anything.
Mike: It’s a good word. He can do anything. He’s beyond the impossible. He can even make something like soccer enjoyable for all of us for 90 minutes.
Chris: We’re sorry, soccer. We’re going to have to apologize.
Mike: We’re apologizing ahead of time, soccer. Thanks so much for joining us. Please consider rating and reviewing our podcast and hitting subscribe on whichever platform you prefer.
Outro: Remember to keep moving forward, because we’re not quite there.
